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Cult Character Designer 3 (internal codename: Hero Forge)

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Cult Character Designer 3 (internal codename: Hero Forge)

Unread postby icycalm » 07 Sep 2020 00:51

3D-printed color miniatures. You design them on their site, and I think you then order them for delivery.

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https://www.heroforge.com

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You GOTTA watch the KS trailer. I haven't found it on YT, so go over to KS and watch it, then come back.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/he ... o-forge-20

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Now 3D-printed miniatures are useless to us for anything other than desk decoration, and even then I'd just buy a professionally-made statue, but if the designs could be exported to TaleSpire it would be awesome. However: https://talespire.backerkit.com/faq

Bouncyrock wrote:Can we import models from Hero Forge?

That would be awesome, Hero Forge rocks. However is is against the TOS.

Also check out our Creature-Crafter stretch goal for an in-game alternative.


Not sure whose TOS he means, TaleSpire's or Hero Forge's. And if it's TaleSpire's, why? Even if it's Hero Forge's it makes no sense. Why would they let you 3D print the miniatures you make, but not export them anywhere? But maybe you can only order 3D prints from THEM. In that case it would make sense if they wanted to limit your options. Nevertheless, it sounds like something TaleSpire can't officially endorse but which people will be able to do anyway.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby ChevRage » 04 Dec 2021 06:12

So here's what I've managed to make so far for my character:

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It was kinda hard to find something suitable since there aren't too many different kinds of robes. You are given a whole bunch of preset already completed outfits, and can mix and match different articles of clothing outside of those. But in the preset 'Sorcerer's Robes' the top doesn't seem to match the bottom properly. So instead I made do with my current outfit which is the 'Wide Mantle Robes' preset.

There are only a few handfuls of human faces too, so if all 16 players that we have so far made a character using this, some people would be doubling up. I know there are some elves amongst you, and I think those are made with a human face and elven ears. There are a whole slew of animals like lizards and bugs and stuff though.

The colour options are really impressive. I just went with a preset theme, but there are a large range of colours and textures like bone, leather and steel. You can save different combinations of colours and textures in a palette for virtual painting. It's just a fill tool though for certain parts of the model, not like you need to brush it on yourself.

You can also pose your character however you want, outside of the presets you can pretty much contort them into any kind of shape. Though I left that alone since you'd need to spend ages to get something that looks natural.

There's an option to remove the base. And there are a cool range of base options if you want them, some of which will let you slot the character on top of a DM screen for example if you want to do that for whatever reason.

Oliver, my character's owl, is also easy to remove if we need to export the figure. There's no option to put him on the shoulder unfortunately, just on the arms, and some familiars can be put on the base instead.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 04 Dec 2021 13:38

That looks pretty incredible. But yes, I’ve noticed that the faces are kind of inbred. It’s a shame because the rest of it is cool. But we can deal with it. It’s not like you’ll be spending your time in TaleSpire zoomed in on people’s faces.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby ysignal » 04 Dec 2021 13:49

Here's what I've got so far:

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I don't think you can pose the lower body directly. You just have to find a preset that's close to what you want from the lower half before you start posing the torso.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 04 Dec 2021 14:06

Wow that's ridiculously close, considering what they give you. I am impressed by both characters. Maybe you guys can do the other people's characters too if you don't mind? It's not particularly urgent. The D&D3 characters would be needed first because they have a whole mansion, but I am putting their campaign on pause for a while so there's no rush.

recoil's shop is too small for the party to live there so there's not much reason for the scene to move there. We'll just build it for the fun of it.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby ysignal » 04 Dec 2021 14:24

Sure, I'm happy to create some characters.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 04 Dec 2021 14:32

Btw, the OP says that it's against TOS to import Hero Forge characters into TaleSpire, but things have changed since then, and official integration has been announced. I have the trailer of the announcement up on the Most Wanted reel:

HeroForge Support is Coming To TaleSpire
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU5RiCa ... XVyolQO3wj

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The video goes up to 4K btw, which means TaleSpire and these assets will look good at that res. I can't imagine how awesome a 4K TaleSpire will look like. AoE4 might not allow you to zoom out more than 1998, but TaleSpire will show them how it's done. We're talking thousands of units across terrain larger than a PA planet. I.e. more units and surface area than the largest-scale RTS ever. AND the deepest building and terraforming systems ever, from stonepunk era all the way to cyberpunk. And on a 150-inch projector screen? And role-playing campaigns as "grinding" for the loot to build all this up?

What game can compete with this?

That's why I don't give up, even though every day brings a fresh problem.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby Archonus » 04 Dec 2021 20:11

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Here's my attempt at wine-swilling playboy druid Arco Arboros. There's no option for a wolf animal companion in the same way that Chev has Oliver perched on his character's arm, but there is an option for the character to ride a warg and to depict the mount on its own. Arco's wolf Terrycloth will transform into a dire wolf if he reaches level 7, which makes him large enough for Arco to ride if he wanted to.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby Robomoo » 04 Dec 2021 20:16

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Here's mine. I couldn't get the armour to match exactly but I think it's close enough. I don't like that the hammer is enormous so I might make the final version without it.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 04 Dec 2021 20:19

Wow those are pretty great! Robo's especially is the split image of him! I am also glad we have the wolf as a separate mini. Can't we get the owl that way too?

I can't wait to see all 16 characters put in some castle siege with hundreds of units all around. We should set one up just for a pic after we've made all of them. Man oh man, this is getting realer by the day.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 04 Dec 2021 20:20

So basically, we'll have two versions of each character for TaleSpire: the Hero Forge version, and the paper mini. And we'll choose between them depending on what the enemies are like. If we have them in 3D, fair enough, if not we're going all-paper.
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Re: [WEB] Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 04 Dec 2021 20:22

So theoretically it'd be possible to churn out 20 versions of your character on Hero Forge with different clothes, weapons, armor, mounts, etc.

Not saying we should do it. But it's great to know it's possible. They should offer a package deal for it.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby ysignal » 05 Dec 2021 01:21

Regarding the owl, I had a look at one of the example models in Blender, and it looks like most objects should be easy to separate from the character:

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They don't come separated, but the underlying geometry seems to be the same as it would be if they were, so you can get Blender to split the model into pieces for you.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 05 Dec 2021 02:27

I wonder if you could remove Robo's hammer, shrink it, and put it back in his hand. But I suppose he'd have to buy the character with the hammer for us to try it out, and if it didn't work he'd have to buy him again without the hammer?
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby ysignal » 05 Dec 2021 03:14

It's definitely possible in Blender, but if the shaft of the resized hammer was too small for the hands you might have to repose the fingers, which is much harder than resizing things and moving them around, especially because the models don't come rigged. I've played around with rigging before, but not enough to get good at it. If we can't make that work we probably can't edit it to remove the hammer either, so as you say we'd probably have to buy it again.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby ChevRage » 05 Dec 2021 15:46

Just took a look through Hero Forge, and there's no way to detach the owl from the character using the in-built tools. Mounts like the warg have a little checkbox option to have the mount only, but that can't be done with the small creatures.

On the other hand, TaleSpire does have an owl figurine itself (which looks kinda similar to Oliver, albeit a greyish-brown colour). I don't think we need to worry too much about exporting the familiars through Hero Forge. Though I guess it would be nice for the sake of consistency.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 05 Dec 2021 16:32

So Archonus would have to buy two miniatures? One of him and one of the wolf?

I definitely want to do whatever is possible to get as much consistency as possible, so if there's any way to get the small familiars too, I want to do it. And it seems it's easy enough to do it in Blender. Keep in mind also that this isn't the last such issue we'll face, so we may as well jump in and figure as much of this stuff out now as we can. The Lord Ashes guy has tutorials on YouTube on how to FULL ANIMATE your minis yourself. And then he has other tutorials on how to import and apply animation to TaleSpire. We might be able to make these minis sit in a couch, lie down on a bed, ride a horse, swim in the sea or climb a mountain. You're telling me you don't want this? One way or another, at least one of us will HAVE to learn to use Blender and other such programs, or at least we'll wait until someone joins us who can. So it's best to buckle down and accept that this stuff will be part of our game too from now on.

When you have your minis in front of you in the TaleSpire world, and it's all consistent, you'll see it makes a big difference.

Robo's hammer issue is small compared to the animals, and if I was him I wouldn't have minded the enlarged hammer, but he has a certain idea in his mind about his character and it's best for all of us if he is happy with the results, so if we can do it, I want to do it. And as for the rigging, ysignal, keep in mind there are people on Fiverr who know how to do it and might charge us $10 or $20 for it. Is it worth it to fix the hammer issue? It's up to to Robo. If I was him, I would do it.

Keep also in mind that in the old days you'd pay the same amount of money, or more, for a lead miniature, and you wouldn't get anything close to what you wanted lol, since the selection was so limited. $10 for a miniature is par for the course for RPGs, and especially D&D which is so tactical. So $10 per character you make, pretty much. So, to me, it makes perfect sense to pay an extra $10 in 2021 with the added benefit of getting EXACTLY what you want.

Of course if the character dies in the next session, it's kind of a waste of money. Not however if you compare it to movies. How much is a movie ticket these days? $10-15? For 90 minutes of fun? The session you died in was probably five-eight hours, and more fun than the movie...

To me, there's really no limit to how much I am willing to spend on RPGs. What's the point of working a dayjob 40 hours a week if you can't even spend a few bucks on your favorite entertainment at the end of the week?

/rant over. I just wanted to give you guys my viewpoint on spending $$$ in RPGs, as they work very differently from traditional videogames. You REALLY do need all the DLC here. Each little thing might not make a big difference, but all of them together make a massive one. It's day and night. I didn't just spend 1000 euros on Fantasy Grounds for no reason. You'll get it when you see the overworld's final form.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 05 Dec 2021 16:47

It's actually three. One of him on the wolf, one of him without the wolf, and the wolf.

With Chev it's two. One of him with the owl, and one of him without it. The owl alone we get separately via Blender.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 05 Dec 2021 17:36

I do see why Robo wants a smaller hammer. It's more elegant, his character is a sophisticated soldier, not Guts from Berserk.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby Robomoo » 05 Dec 2021 18:01

If you subscribe to 'Hero Forge Pro+ Download', you can get 5 models per month, and your downloads roll over so you don't have to use them all up in one month. It costs $20/month, or a bit less if you sign up for multiple months.

The ultimate solution would be if we can figure out how to add rigs to the models well ourselves, or just pay someone to do it for us. I think it's relatively simple to learn. That would allow us to put the characters in any pose we want, including preset poses made by others, and apply the Mixamo animations to them. The models in the Hero Forge editor have a rig already; that's how you're able to apply poses to them. But the models they let you download have the rig removed, I guess so that they can sell you the different poses.

Bouncyrock said in a comment on the TaleSpire video that the TaleSpire-integrated version of Hero Forge also won't give us rigged models.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby Some guy » 05 Dec 2021 18:30

Here's my attempt:

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The amulets in Hero Forge are way too big, there's nothing he can hold with just his fingers, there also aren't any tables. That outfit is the closest I could get, there wasn't anything similar to the golden shoulder pads and gauntlet thing.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 05 Dec 2021 18:34

That Pro sub is quite the deal. If four people sign up for one month each, we get 20 minis at $4 each. Can you guys export your saved mini file and give them to whoever gets the sub? So that you won't have to do them over again.

Or, since we've made exactly four minis so far, each of you can get the sub for one month, then you finalize your own designs, then you pass your password over to three other people to make their own designs, and that's it: 16 minis for $4 each. And for the remaining 4 minis we can make characters that are relevant to the people who have TaleSpire holdings currently: recoil's dad, and Robo's parents, and say two servants.

Beyond that, I could get an official Battlegrounds Pro sub and keep it going forever, so that it accumulates minis for when groups TPK, or new people or groups join, or I simply need NPCs that visit your TaleSpire holdings. But to start with we need the four of you to get Pro subs because we need 20 characters and my sub would only give us 5 right now. Plus, I am banned from PayPal so people can't really send me money for minis easily.

This is all working out so well. We should be able to build a large library of TaleSpire characters to cover most of our needs fairly inexpensively. The animation possibilities are merely the cherry on top. Please keep looking into them and keep us posted.


TL;DR I think that Chev, ysignal, Archonus and Robo should get the Pro sub, buy their own minis, then pass the password to others to make their minis (or you can make their minis yourselves if the others aren't very good at it). And then each person can PayPal you $4.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 05 Dec 2021 18:39

Your mini looks great Rory. The face especially is identical. Approved.

Everything posted so far is approved. If you want to make changes, post a new pic for approval. Don't buy anything yet though until we've figured out the sub angle.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby ExiledOne » 11 Dec 2021 17:57

Here's my half-elf rogue, Valkian:

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ysignal made it for me before I got to start on it. I changed the eye color to green since that's what was on my character sheet and I changed the ears to the half-elf ones. There didn't seem to be any way to add the armlet or to arrange the swords in a similar way as they are in the illustration. Thanks again, ysignal.
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Re: WEB Hero Forge

Unread postby icycalm » 11 Dec 2021 18:18

That program is insane. They have everything we need to make characters from random jpegs we pulled off the web. Truly astonishing science-fiction technology, just as genius as Fantasy Grounds, Foundry, TaleSpire, World Anvil, Syrinscape, et al.

So we got all of D&D3, which is awesome as that's where the minis are needed the most. I suggest one of you buy a Pro subscription for one month, and then download all four models. Then give them to me to archive on the site, and then I'll give them to ysignal to try to put them in TaleSpire. I should have the mansion soon too, and we can try them in there. Let's try to get all this done next week. And by the end of the week I'll also have the overworld so we can put the mansion in there. And next weekend we finally continue your campaign and hopefully get to the title sequence so we can formally launch Battlegrounds (I'll have a Patreon update about this when it happens).

So all the minis posted in this thread so far are approved. If you want to make changes to them, post the new pics here for approval first.

The other groups should wait until we're 100% done with D&D3, so as not to clog up the thread. The next group will be D&D2, and I'll let you know when to start.
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