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Unread postby icycalm » 17 Sep 2013 04:17

I had an idea. Maybe it would help if we tried to rebaptize "indie" games to hippie games, without scare quotes. They want a new label, I'll give them a new label, only this one is much more accurate, since, as I've explained, "indie" games are the most dependent games possible, while the lazy, bullshit attitude of hippies is a perfect match for the lazy, bullshit attitude of "indies". So perhaps it'd be a good idea to adopt the hippie label from now on. Maybe I'll write an article about this or work it into an existing one. It's not a posting guideline yet, so everyone can do whatever they like, but I am considering it.

Think about it. "Hippie game designer Derek Yu released a new title-screen-only game yesterday..."

Or, "The Hippie Game Festival Trophy for Best Hippie Game was won by Jason Roher's Game Up My Ass, a game which he shoved up his ass for future generations to excavate and discover".
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Unread postby Dolt » 21 Sep 2013 03:20

Advice from David Jaffe that might be helpful to resentful "indies":

http://criminalcrackdown.blogspot.co.uk ... u-are.html

I was asked by a guy who follows me on twitter what I thought about this article that just went up on Kotaku. It's written by someone calling themselves ANONYMOUS GAME DEVELOPER* (AGD) and the gist of the piece is that game developers- and thus games themselves- suffer because of the current power of the game publishers.

I figured I'd share my response here as a topic of discussion:

I agree with a number of AGD's theories about why modern games are tough to get right (i.e. AGD's write up on game's desire to be film vs. games was pretty spot on) but I reject the tired accusation that it's the publisher keeping game developers down. And I reject that accusation because of the classic line that I am sure you've heard before: you are worth what you can negotiate.

Period.


Don't like the way a publisher treats you?

Don't sign a contract with that particular publisher. Or if you do, make sure you have what you will and won't tolerate written into the contract.

And if your studio is not good enough to demand better deals and is not clever enough to secure alternate forms of financing (thus allowing you to bypass the publishers all together) then you deserve what you get.

I am very sympathetic to the article's core (it can suck being a dev when you feel your failure stems from forces out of your control)** but that is very much the whole 'every kid who plays gets a trophy even if their team loses' thinking.

AKA: This is business.

You want to be treated better? Sign a contract demanding it.

You are not able to get such a contract? Then improve your team until you can demand in the real world what you think you are really worth in your mind.

Because at the moment the real world is making something very clear to you. And that is this:

For the time being anyway, you are not as good as you think you are.

The people who fight against this and complain that the world is not fair are spinning their wheels and wasting their time. The people who embrace this truth can then decide to either get out of the business or put the effort into getting so good that they can pretty much write their own ticket. ***

David

* It would not surprise me if this was written by one of the editors and attributed to AGD. I have no inside info, just saying I could see this being the case.

** The idea that 'if it just wasn't for the stupid, interfering publisher we woulda had a hit/we woulda made something more artistic' is pretty tired. I'm not saying this is not the case in many instances. But in many other cases- as a guy who has worked for the publisher and for the developer- I can tell you that at least 50% of the time the developer just isn't good enough to make the great game they think they are capable of making, regardless of how much creative freedom they have.

*** In the majority of cases, when it comes to super expensive $40-$60 retail products, no matter how good a dev you are, you will still not get the best deal in the universe. This is because at that high price point marketing and brand still rule the roost because the number of people who follow quality over the siren's call of a flashy marketing campaign are not near enough to turn the tides. And a vast majority of game consumers would rather- understandably- have the comfort of knowing what they are getting for their $60 (i.e. sequels) rather than take a chance- at that same high price- on something that sounds interesting and has great reviews but is unknown. However, when you are talking digital games for $14.99 (and ideally less), talent can begin to demand amazing deals if they have the track record to back up their demands because core gamers- as always- will continue to follow the talented teams and average gamers will take chances at those lower 'impulse buy' price points. We will see this more in the coming generation of games as getting core games digitally stops being something that only the core gamers do and -with each passing year- becomes the normal way for all gamers to acquire new content.
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Unread postby icycalm » 16 Jan 2014 06:37

It's hilarious how hippy pseudo-developers try to ape the manners of real developers. This fagot is making a 4-polygon game on a decade-old laptop, and he's making a fuss over whether his pitiful student game will run at 1080p 60FPS on the PS4 as if it's Call of Duty. Motherfucker such a primitive game should run at 1,000FPS lol. What an imbecile. It's a disgrace Sony and MS are allowing them to publish this trash on their consoles at all. Oh for the days of the Nintendo Seal of Quality!

http://gematsu.com/2014/01/volume-aimin ... ystation-4

Sal Romano wrote:Volume aiming for 1080p, 60fps on PlayStation 4
Bithell won't utilize PS4 touchpad 'just because it's there.'

Volume-60fps-1080p-Aim.jpg
Volume-60fps-1080p-Aim.jpg (24.99 KiB) Viewed 9156 times


Volume, Mike Bithell’s upcoming stealth game for PlayStation 4, PS Vita, PC, and Mac, is aiming for 1080p resolution and 60 frames per second on PS4, he’s said.

“Honestly, I’m going to aim for 60 frames per second and 1080p,” Bithell told GamingBolt. “I’m actually developing the game on a four year old laptop. So I think and I’m pretty confident that we can hit that. Games feel better at 60 FPS so I’m going to do everything I can to hit that.”

Asked if he’ll be utilizing any platform specific features on PlayStation 4 or PS Vita, Bithell said “I’m sure we’ll do something with [the PlayStation 4 touchpad],” but said it won’t be forced simply because it’s there.

Volume is due out in 2014.


And of course the loser non-gamer who runs Gematsu is treating this as serious news instead of plastering the page with gigantic lololols.
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Unread postby icycalm » 17 Jan 2014 17:56

https://twitter.com/PG_kamiya/status/424074408538296320

Hideki Kamiya wrote:We don't make games by one person. RT @EzeLuigi83: how long does it take for one person to make a game? if you have any idea or as a team ?
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Unread postby icycalm » 22 Jan 2014 01:59

Well, it's good to know that "indie" games continue to be made by small groups of two or three friends, compared to the huge teams that make dependie games.

http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/the-s ... le/details

Kevin MacLeod Additional Music
Davey Wreden Writer / Designer
William Pugh Writer / Designer
Kevan Brighting Voice: Narrator
Collin Eddings Additional Level Design
Jack Parsons Additional Level Design
Jesus Higueras Programming
Andreas Jorgensen Modeling
Robin Arnott Sound Design
Eduardo Ortiz Sound Design
Blake Robinson Original Music
Yiannis Ioannides Original Music
Christiaan Bakker Original Music
Lesley Staples Voice: Additional Voicework
Aviva Pinchas Voice: Additional Voicework
Jenny Kuglin Voice: Additional Voicework
Siddhartha Barhnoorn Additional Music
Dean Darko Stanley Character Skin
Miika Lahti Original Artwork
Simon Boxer Original Artwork
Ry Soderberg Animation
Maxime Lebled Animation



http://www.giantbomb.com/akai-katana/30 ... 9/credits/

Audio
Ryu Umemoto - Composer

Unclassified
Daisuke Koizumi
Hideki Nomura
Kenichi Takano
Shinobu Yagawa
Tsuneki Ikeda
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Unread postby icycalm » 25 Jan 2014 20:17

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014- ... s-miyamoto

Oli Welsh wrote:Nintendo is a games company. It has absolutely no vested interest in the console business beyond selling video games - primarily its own video games. It is, really, a developer-publisher, an autonomous premium games label, like Blizzard or Rockstar.


In other words an independent game developer. Even more independent than id or Platinum are. Even more than Blizzard or Rockstar. SO INDEPENDENT THAT THE MOTHERFUCKERS MAKE THEIR OWN FUCKING HARDWARE LOL BECAUSE THEY WANT TO BE IN COMPLETE CONTROL OF THE CREATIVE PROCESS. I MEAN HOW FUCKING HARDCORE IS THAT?

But no, what independent really means is that you are buddies with Derek Yu, and unfortunately Iwata, Miyamoto and co. have committed the fatal mistake of not trying to cozy up to him, so they will forever be known as soulless, mainstream hacks who are churning out trash and are only in it for the money.
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Unread postby icycalm » 12 Mar 2014 17:37

54Aj7Fb.jpg
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Unread postby icycalm » 10 Apr 2014 23:15

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=799964

Flarin wrote:Is $20 the new $15 for indie games?

For the better part of this last generation top tier indie games have always cost $15. Fez, Braid, Super Meat Boy, Journey, etc. were all $15 at launch, if I recall right.

However, could a few games be turning the tide for the future? Mercenary Kings just launched at the price of $20 and it was just announced today that Transistor will be $20 when it launches in May (Bastion was $15 at launch too if I remember right).

Is this a sign of things to come or simply a few outliers? What say you, GAF?


SwiftDeath wrote:I have no idea although it would be interesting if prices of DL-only indie games moved towards the $20 price point as it might suggest larger budgets being possible among other things going forward for indie games


"Other things" like for example better aesthetics, more complex mechanics, bigger dev teams and larger PR budgets?

The lols, omg the lols.
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Unread postby Gaius » 30 Jul 2014 05:48

Article on IGN, "Why Do So Many People Hate Indie Games?":

http://au.ign.com/articles/2014/07/29/w ... ndie-games

In recent months, I’ve felt an overwhelming sense of disappointment when I scroll through the comments of the coverage of “indie games” here on IGN (or on other sites and on Twitter, at that). While many folks praise these games (and a vast, vast majority of people who read IGN don’t comment at all), I can’t help but notice a lot of hatred cast against these games, too.


The article in and of itself isn't notable, it follows the "ignorant people don't like new things" line of thought, but I thought it was notable that this topic and viewpoint appeared on the world's biggest videogame website. I was also somewhat surprised because in the videogame media I personally consume and am exposed to, "indie" games are near universally praised (apart from this site). This passage stood out:

The point is, both sides of the spectrum have weight and value, yet the scale is slowly (and demonstrably) being tipped toward the so-called indie side in terms of not only volume, but in terms of quality. And again, I don't mean indie literally; I mean it in the sense of how a lot of the haters mean it, describing smaller games made on smaller budgets from smaller teams. This shift marks an inevitable move as the mid-tier developers all but disappear, triple-A-reliant studios close down left and right, and the few big publishers left streamline their operations to make the most money (though I have to give a shoutout to Ubisoft here, a publisher that supports games across the spectrum, and Sony, who gives money hand-over-fist to studios it doesn't even own to create IP that isn't even exclusive).

Indie – in some way, shape, or form – is the future, my friends. Just look at our current landscape – bloated budgets, disappointing sales, and a fragmenting market – and then take a peek at a much more promising horizon, built on ingenuity and new ideas, untethered from absurd budgets and equally absurd commercial expectations that have already taken so many publishers and developers victim.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 04:41

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123293297

Tertullian wrote:People sometimes shitting on indie games as a class is probably an emotional reaction to other people giving indie games a pass in almost everything. Taken in general, indie games have every bit as many problems, and every bit as much stagnation, as AAA games, but every single day I read that the AAA market is worthy of ridicule while indies are the beautiful, innovative saviors of the industry. It gets tiring and breeds resentment.

What portion of indie games are sidescrolling puzzle platformers, difficult action roguelikes, or games with shallow gameplay but "deep" narratives (and by deep, I mean "freshman philosophy student at community college" deep)? What portion of indies rely on 16-bit pixel art of the sort we've seen ten thousand times before?

But for some reason, we're not allowed to talk about indie games as a group, or the indie game space in game development. No; because impressive games like FTL exist, the vast majority of samey, boring, derivitive indies games are above criticism. Because every 20th indie games is good, we aren't allowed to talk about indie games as a whole.

Or no, not even that. We're allowed to talk about indie games in general, but only if we're worshipping them as the source of all innovation and the saviors in the industry. We can talk about them in general if we have something nice to say. But if we have something mean to say, it's "you can't make generalizations like that!"

Something like the above is probably the thought process that motivates hatred directed towards indie games in general.


That, and because they suck.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 04:54

Insomnia reader confirmed: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123295208

elektrixx wrote:
redcrayon wrote:As you say, it's a case-by-case thing, but there are thousands upon thousands of indie games with a far wider variety of art styles, genre and gameplay than AAA can ever hope to meet.


I disagree as far as art styles go. Indie devs are only doing what real devs already did 20 years ago, except now it's in HD. I'm not just talking about pixel art either.


Nobody who hasn't read my articles claims that "indie" devs aren't real devs. And he denies both the aesthetic AND mechanical claims to innovation of the "indies". It is very important to emphasize that "indies" suck at absolutely everything with no exceptions ever.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 05:05

Oh hey, here's an argument that never occurred to me. I mean the last line:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123298040

Rafterman wrote:
Pyrrhus wrote:People pick up on the pretentious, self-aggrandizing vibe that defines some parts of the indie game scene and they don't like it.


That's part of it, albeit a small part, but the biggest part for me is the overwhelming gushing and slurping of these games just because they are "indie". I don't really give a shit if a game is made by two people in a basement or five hundred in some corporate monstrosity they should be judged equally based on their content. And it's hilarious that the article bemoans the fact that people dismiss indie games outright, because more often than not the exact opposite happens, where people prop these games up just for being indie or because they are cheap. The fact is, and I've said this before, the average indie darling would be absolutely crucified if it had EA name slapped on it.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 05:13

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123299435

doofy102 wrote:Because it's too easy to hate looking at this.

braid-psn-nov-12.jpg
braid-psn-nov-12.jpg (40.95 KiB) Viewed 8852 times


And first impressions matter. For better or worse, the media made this the definitive indie game for a while, and Braid lacked good platforming design yet decided it would reference itself against (and thus compare itself to) fucking Mario Bros (whether or not the puzzles in Braid were good doesn't really save it from this factor) with a pretentious allegory story that ironically sounded like it would've been a lot more interesting if it weren't symbolised/obscure at all and was actually the content of the main game. The "twist" with the girl didn't actually say anything profound about Mario tropes, though dumb reviewers who wanted to look smart acted as though it did. And so, we soon had another source of contempt for game reviewers.

To a lot of people watching, this was a "definitive 2D Indie title," which turned a lot of them off the movement altogether. People who were still watching then had to face an embarrassing onslaught of fools trying to make indie games sound like the salvation of gaming, thanks to stuff like Braid, a "successor" to old 2D gaming, pfft.


There are a bunch of cool gamers on NeoGAF who know their shit. You just have to search among the fluff and bull to find their posts.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 05:21

That thread is a goldmine of "indie" hatred. For every 10 pro-"indie" or ambivalent posts, there is an arrow of death aimed right at the heart of the "indie" monster.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123300695

Odrion wrote:
Diprosalic wrote:i don't hate them but a good chunk of the hyped ones are style over substance games. there's just as much garbage in the indie world as there is in the normal AAA world.


Honestly not true, you're just unaware of how deep the rabbit hole goes on bad indie games.

There are some people who describe Bioshock Infinite or The Last of Us as "awful" experiences. I doubt that. I bet they were boring to that person, but they haven't played anything as truly unpleasant as the five billion bad unity games that exist.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 05:45

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123307043

IAmRandom31 wrote:
Qassim wrote:Can someone answer me this:

Why are some of you people still so insistent on changing what an independent developer is? They could have 500 employees and they'd still be independent. They could have a $40m budget and they'd still be indie (e.g. Star Citizen).

This is why people are so confused. Because it seems some of you are adamant that indie means small game developed by 4 or 5 people. When it's not - there are *so many* indies, primarily on PC, that are about 20 - 40 person teams (many in Europe) that are independent studios.

I suppose people could make this mistake if they assume all indie games come to the consoles (when in fact its a tiny fraction of them), and the ones they get exposed to on the consoles are representative of *all* independent developers.


Yeah, I wonder this too.

Indie simply means independent. They make games without a publisher or publisher financial backing. They have complete development freedom over the product they make.

Valve = independent developer
Hello Games = independent developer

One team has hundreds, the other has dozens. Still the same thing.


If people agreed that Valve is an independent developer and Valve games are indie (and therefore also Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, Sega, etc.), the label would lose its magical powers to prop up the shitty games of shitty developers. So people hedge and fudge, and we remain without a definition outside of the one I gave in my Myth of Independence essay (which will one day be quoted on the Wikipedia page on "indie", mark my words).
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 06:15

Another confirmed Insomnia reader: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123333941

He goes by Riposte on NeoGAF and "another riposte" here. His analysis is basically rewordings of my articles, but he does a decent job. Obviously it would have been better if he dropped a couple of links to me because you can't fit shit in three paragraphs, but nobody links me on NeoGAF anymore because they don't want to get banned.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 06:20

This is a new spin on it, though, and a good one:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123336437

Riposte wrote:Isn't it interesting that the wider the net is cast it is only the idea "I hate indie games" (unsaid exceptions, neutral/unknown entities ignored) that becomes more ridiculous, not "I love indie games" (ditto) when that becomes less true as genres and games (e.g., F2P mobile trash) that are not loved take up more and more space?

The polarized reactionary nature of the "indie" marketing brand means that there is a conscious and unconscious effort to increase the number of games that are called "indie" and decrease the number of games called "AAA" and fit everything under this dichotomy. It has been wildly successful so far. In the end though, this will mean "I hate indie games" will become "I hate games", but at the same time "I love indie games" will mean "I love games". Both are useless.


Since quintuple A has come to mean "bad" and "indie" has come to mean "good", everyone who can conceivably claim the "indie" label is trying to. If EA could call Battlefield "indie" they would. Personally, I wish they would do it.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 06:25

The student has learned his lesson well! He was even bold enough to use the terms "reactionary" and "decadent"!

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread. ... t123341129

Riposte wrote:What I've argued primarily is that why and by who those decisions were made should not matter in the slightest. The effect of those decisions, the game design and execution, is what should matter. To step away from that, even a little, is decadent and I would argue the "indie vs AAA" phenomenon has been more than a few steps. In my right mind, I don't believe there is any value nor any inherent truth in what you proposed. For example, "design process" is a very vague notion that can be easily transformed to match one's argument, whether that be differentiating big budget games from each other (such as big or really big, small budget games from each other (such as small or really small), big vs. mid. vs small games, or perhaps making these sound more similar to each other.

To be clear, as terms/concepts, I hold both "AAA" and "indie" in low regard. If I'm softer on "AAA" it is only because it is not a reactionary idea like "indie" and has become a victim of its own success in terms of the dichotomy people are trying to create; it was always a sly marketing term though and a negative influence of game discussion.

While at a glance it may seem that I'm getting too much into "semantics", I'm tackling ideas that are very common on NeoGAF and elsewhere that happened to be buttressed on these nonsensical terms. In the end, I can't confront these ideas without attacking the words and vice versa. In truth people often underestimated the influence of semantics, because the most deceiving ideas have always been supported by poor language; too often does it feel like a way to dismiss an argument.


He has more posts in there, I am not quoting everything, so look for them if you want.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 06:34

Still, all his posts will not have a thousandth of the effect that dropping links to my articles would have. Random posts that touch on random aspects of the issue, as opposed to my complete top-to-bottom analysis that is and will remain unmatched. If you really cared about the health of the artform and about informing your fellow gamers YOU WOULD LINK ME. That is the best way to help everyone. You can add your own comments, and you can also rephrase as much of mine as you want, but if you don't link me it's the equivalent of denying the astronomy textbook to the aspiring astronomy student and instead chatting with him about astronomy. He will never become an astronomer in this way. He NEEDS the textbook to deepen his understanding of the issues. It doesn't matter WHY you are not linking me. Either fear of repercussions, or desire to appear as someone that "thinks for himself", etc. It's either stupid, or cowardly, and it reflects badly on you. Be courageous. Stand up for what you believe. And face the music if there's music to be faced.

Or stay a coward if that's what's written into your genes.
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Unread postby icycalm » 31 Jul 2014 06:44

17 pages, half a dozen confirmed Insomnia readers, and who knows how many unconfirmed ones, and still no links to my articles that answer every single question raised in there. I have to write an article about this. It is a new phenomenon.
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Unread postby icycalm » 25 Aug 2014 04:25

Scammer whining that his scam don't work so well no more because there are too many scammers now:

http://www.puppygames.net/blog/?p=1574

Cas wrote:Then Steam came (and to a lesser extent, Big Fish Games).

Things changed fast. So fast that in other industries it would have been seen as a cataclymically disruptive event. The upshot of it is, within 5 short years, the value of an independent game plummeted from about $20 to approximately $1, with very few exceptions. Steam is great! You can sell loads of games! But only if they’re less than $10. Technically Valve don’t actually dictate the prices we charge. Actually, they do. Utterly. It’s just not talked about. In fact technically, I don’t think anyone’s allowed to talk about it.

Then came the Humble Bundle and all its little imitators.

It was another cataclysmically disruptive event, so soon on the heels of the last. Suddenly you’ve got a massive problem on your hands. You’ve sold 40,000 games! But you’ve only made enough money to survive full-time for two weeks because you’re selling them for 10 cents each. And several hundred new customers suddenly want their computers fixing for free. And when the dust from all the bundles has settled you’re left with a market expectation of games now that means you can only sell them for a dollar. That’s how much we sell our games for. One dollar. They’re meant to be $10, but nobody buys them at $10. They buy them when a 90% discount coupon lands in their Steam inventory. We survive only by the grace of 90% coupon drops, which are of course entirely under Valve’s control. It doesn’t matter how much marketing we do now, because Valve control our drip feed.


Maybe now they are regretting advertising their scam so loudly, and urging others to start their own scam. But I suspect they are too stupid to even realize this at this point.
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Unread postby icycalm » 16 Sep 2014 21:19

With the Humble Bundles what I do, and what I advise people to do, is give everything to the developers.

But with the "indie" bundles I do the opposite: zero to the developers and everything to the Humble company. (In both cases I give nothing to charity.) So I get their games, just in case I want to trash them in a review, and also to pad my Steam library and get a higher rank, without the scammers getting a dime from me, and I advise everyone to do the same. Gotta love those bundles!
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Unread postby icycalm » 17 Sep 2014 02:34

http://www.lar.net/2014/09/12/thoughts- ... omes-next/

Swen Vincke wrote:Listen to your community, but be aggressive in your triage and remember that game development requires enlightened despotism, not democracy.


That quote needs to go in a book somewhere.
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Unread postby icycalm » 23 Sep 2014 20:07

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/st ... final-push

Not enough lols on the internet.

eec3ace5c705a679dc8e5df9999921cb_large.jpg


Look at how non-conformist we are! We were all born with that hair color!
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Unread postby icycalm » 07 Jan 2015 21:08

http://www.bundlestars.com/all-bundles/abstract-bundle/

Bundle Stars wrote:Abstract Bundle
A mash-up of multi-platform games!
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