Games

[ronan]

Logos list updated. I finally put the longest logos in a frame. It doesn't look so bad, in fact. As for the Playstation 3, it seems that the abbreviated logo "PS3" is now official, so I used it. I will do an arcade/jamma logo later.

[icycalm]

Looking good! Can't wait to try them out in reviews. I'll do some test runs as soon as I am able. The first issue of Postback EX has been pushed back a day or two...

[ronan]

Arcade logos added. I don't like so much the idea of putting a Jamma logo, though. It's only a connection, and it isn't used for all arcade games.

[icycalm]

I updated the Kage, Metal Slug and Herzog Zwei banners. The Herzog Zwei review still has the old layout, but I will fix it one of these days.

By the way, I am quite surprised that you like the old Metal Slug header: not only does it feature screenshots, but the art seems to come from Metal Slug X:

I did not know that it came from X, so I removed it. As for why I like it: because it's nice. Yes, I would prefer it without the screenshot, but the person who made it could not remove it. So I kept it. I can't always have everything that I want, so I have to pick the best from what is available to me.

As for the Jamma thing: I never asked for it. Recap uses Jamma -- I use "Custom". All games which are physically connected to the hardware they run on (including things like Nintendo's Game & Watch handhelds, for example) are categorized as "Custom". So if you could replace the Jamma with Custom we'll be fine.

I have more comments to make on your (truly awesome) logos, but I'll do that in detail later. I also need to update the Half-Life header, but for some reason the hosting service you use has taken it offline. I'll try again later.

[ronan]

As for the Jamma thing: I never asked for it.

Well, you did for a review of Captain Commando, but I understand now. I have added a "Custom" logo (and also some other logos such as a "PC" one).

As for the old Metal Slug header, since you liked it, I could try to make a frontpage header based on the same artwork.

[JoshF]

For Ronan: http://web.archive.org/web/20060620181441/http://www.antiriad.com/retro.htm

[ronan]

Hey, nice! Thank you, Josh.

[icycalm]

Those are awesome. That site also has a collection of line drawings of like a billion systems if I remember correctly. I once stumbled onto it but then lost the address. I will have to upload all that stuff to the archive just in case the site ever disappears.

Ronan, I updated the Half-Life review with the retouched header. I also have these two headers I'd like you to touch up for me if possible.

This one needs a logo (the Japanese one, if it differs from the US version):

http://insomnia.ac/reviews/playstation2 ... antasyxii/

And in this one there's a little pegasus on the top right of the image which I would like you to airbrush out if you can:

http://insomnia.ac/archive/genres/srpg_turn-based/

[ronan]

Headers added

[icycalm]

I used the SRPG one, thanks! But I don't understand what you did with the FFXII ones. Could you not find the logo anywhere? I'll try to find it later today.

One other thing... The SRPG header I gave you was .jpg and you turned into .png. This doesn't really make sense, since all you are doing is doubling or tripling the size of the image without improving the quality. A .jpg image has already been compressed, it has already lost some information -- by converting it into .png you are not restoring any of that information, you are only making the file unnecessarily larger. So when the image or images you start out with are in .jpg or .gif format or whatever, they should stay in that format. Only when you are doing screen capturing, or something of this nature, should you save the file as .png -- in all other instances there's no point to it.

[ronan]

But I don't understand what you did with the FFXII ones. Could you not find the logo anywhere? I'll try to find it later today.

It is the art of the Japanese (and European) cover. What else do you want?

Different box shots available from here:
http://www.neoseeker.com/Games/Products/PS2/final_fantasy_xii/

One other thing... The SRPG header I gave you was .jpg and you turned into .png. This doesn't really make sense [...].

Yes, it does. If I only had to rotate the image, I would have been able to save the changes losslessly. (There is often an option to do so in image editing software.) But in this case, I had to edit the image, and I don't own the software that could allow me to save the changes without further degrading the unedited part of the image. If you know such a software for mac that is free, let me know.

It also makes sense to convert GIF files into PNG, because the file can be made smaller.

[icycalm]

What else do you want?

The logo. Just the logo. I have already made the graphics -- we don't need any more.

But in this case, I had to edit the image, and I don't own the software that could allow me to save the changes without further degrading the unedited part of the image. If you know such a software for mac that is free, let me know.

I guess I just don't know how this stuff works, but with my limited understanding I was under the impression that when you edit a .jpg, no matter what edits you do, you have nothing to gain in terms of quality by saving as a .png. But I could be wrong on this. I will email NFG, who knows quite a bit more than me about all this, and ask him. He was the one who told me about this, because at first I would save all my .jpgs as .pngs, thinking that this would improve the images' quality. NFG noticed that and told me to stop doing it. So I'll email him your problem and see what he says.

It makes also sense to convert GIF files into PNG, because the file can be made smaller.

Really? I was under the impression that the .png format is the heaviest format in terms of size.

[ronan]

The logo. Just the logo.

So you just want the text "Final Fantasy XII". I will do that.

I was under the impression that when you edit a .jpg, no matter what edits you do, you have nothing to gain in terms of quality by saving as a .png.

As NFG told you, and as you have understood, you don't gain anything if you just convert a JPG into a PNG. The JPG format is used to decreased the file size, while inducing some quality loss. It is usually therefore a bad idea to convert a JPG into PNG, because you get a larger file for nothing.

But if you edit a JPG image, it has to be resaved. And if you save it again as a JPG, you will normally degrade the image a little more. I therefore save as a PNG to avoid further degradation.

Really? I was under the impression that the .png format is the heaviest format in terms of size.

I'm not an expert either, but I will try to explain it to you.

A GIF is limited to 256 colors, while a PNG can have trillions. If you convert a JPG or BMP with millions of color into PNG, you will have no quality loss, while if you convert it into GIF, you will have to decrease the number of colors to 256. The resulting GIF file is then of a lesser quality than the PNG, but it's smaller, because it has only 256 colors.

But if you convert this GIF into PNG, the PNG will also have only 256 colors. And since the compression is better for PNG than for GIF, you can get a file that is a bit smaller (by like 10%).

[El Chaos]

Yeah, PNG is essentially the most flexible image format for a couple of uses. For example, take this shot here:



It's saved as an 8-bit GIF file, but the actual image contained in it only has 37 individual colors, so it would be wiser to save it at a 6-bit color depth.



It is the exact same image, but it is 7.92 KB in size, instead of 24.6 KB. That's a ~67% filesize optimization, and at no picture quality loss.

[ronan]

How is this? I like it more without the cover art, in fact.


I also added some CUSTOM and SNK logos.

[icycalm]

@ Chaos: I don't understand. Whenever I save a .jpg as .png the size at least doubles, if not triples...

@ Ronan: I can't see the header. I tried loading the page a dozen times today, but it just won't load for me. I'll try again tomorrow. In the meantime, here's another assignment!



I would like to use this image whenever I ban someone, but instead of "BAN HIM!" I would like it to say "BANNED!", and also I would like the image to be a bit smaller -- maybe half the size. Do you think you can do that?

[ronan]

Header re-uploaded. The logo is a bit small, and not so clear. I could try to change that, if you want.


This one should prove useful:



Also, as I wrote before, converting a JPG into PNG will of course increase the size, while converting a GIF into PNG can decrease it (the example of Chaos being quite extreme.)

Let me explain again:

JPG : millions of colors max, lossy
(good to get a small file, but the quality basically decreases each time you save)
GIF : 256 colors max, lossless
(allows transparency and animation)
PNG : triillions of colors max, lossless
(like an enhanced version of GIF)

Therefore, if you save a JPG with millions of colors (usual case) as a PNG, there is no quality loss (the PNG compresion is lossless), but the size increases because the PNG format cannot take advantage of the (lossy) JPG compression. (The advantage is that you can then edit the image and save it without quality loss)

But if you save a million-color JPG or PNG as a GIF, the number of colors will have to be decreased to 256. The resulting image has therefore a lesser quality, not because of the GIF compression (which is lossless) but simply because it features less colors.

The size of the GIF file might be of the same order than the JPG file (less colors vs. JPG compression) but it will be smaller than that of the PNG. That doesn't mean that the GIF compression is more efficient than the PNG one (it is not), it is just that the GIF has less colors.

But now, if you decide to save the GIF as a PNG, you get a PNG with 256 colors. In that case, the PNG file is smaller, thanks to its better compression. In fact, the PNG format should normally be preferred to GIF, except in some cases (animations...)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portable_Network_Graphics#Comparison_with_other_file_formats

[ronan]

Bump in case you missed my previous post.

[icycalm]

I saw it, it's just that I've only been getting a few minutes of online time per day recently, and the bannings have priority. I can't just let all those idiots run around here without doing anything, whereas I can always delay the updating of graphics, etc. for several days without causing any problems. So, you know, I am doing my best. In the few minutes of online time that I get I need to read and answer my emails, check the statistics reports, ban all the new retards -- and when all of that has been accomplished, only then do I get to do any useful work on the site.

So I used the updated "ban" image for a day or so but then went back to the original one because it turns out I prefer the larger size... it makes more of an impact. I think I prefer the text and font as well... As for the FFXII header, I need to find some time to look for a good logo, because the one you found is quite ugly and very small. There should be a better one, so I'll try to look for one.

Re: the compressions issue. Thanks for all the additional info, but I still don't fully understand what is going on. I'll talk to NFG about it as soon as I get a chance...

[ronan]

Is it fine so? (I could clean the logo a bit more if needed. I already have a big version of it, although partly superimposed to a drawing.)


As for the "banned!" image I changed the image size, text color and font back to the original one (or very close to it):



Also, I had bumped just in case. I already told you that I am not expecting you to answer right away, so don't worry.

[icycalm]

These are much better, thanks! I'll try uploading them tomorrow at some point.

[icycalm]

I uploaded the FFXII banner. Looks good. I also uploaded three of your arcade logos (the ones I liked) here:

http://insomnia.ac/archive/hardware/arcade/

One complaint. Two of those are 80x60, and the other 70x60...

I think the yen one looks great. I wonder though how much money the standard credit went for in Japan in, say, 1987. I am fairly certain it must have been less than 100. And there are quite a few 50-yen arcades around even today. Then we have the American arcade games -- not many of those, but there are still some -- the Williams games, etc.

In any case, that logo will do for most of the arcade reviews. It really looks rather awesome. I'll keep the other logos in reserve for other occasions. Great work!

[ronan]

One complaint. Two of those are 80x60, and the other 70x60...

I initially made the logos with a fixed width of 70 pixels, but for some logos, 80 pixels were necessary, as I stated. Anyway, since they are all aligned to the right, it doesn't make any difference if you put them next to the Insomnia logo. But if for any reason you have to give the position of the left side of the logo, I can understand your problem.

So what would you like? All the logos to be 80 pixels wide?

I think the yen one looks great. I wonder though how much money the standard credit went for in Japan in, say, 1987. I am fairly certain it must have been less than 100. And there are quite a few 50-yen arcades around even today. Then we have the American arcade games -- not many of those, but there are still some -- the Williams games, etc.

Yes, that is why I put a Computer Space cabinet, even if it was kind of a joke. Of course the Astro City cabinet is much more typical. I also like the logo with the coins, but I am sure that many people will not understand it.

[icycalm]

So what would you like? All the logos to be 80 pixels wide?

I would like all of them to be in a single format, for maximum flexibility in their use in the future. So that I will not have to ask you to redo stuff, you see.

[ronan]

Then I will make the upcoming logos with a width of 80 pixels. But most of the current logos have to be edited. I will take care of them later.