[DS] Contra 4

[icycalm]

I have some comments to make on LaserGun's review:

http://lasergun.wordpress.com/2009/02/18/contra_4/

The last and most dull addition is a grappling hook feature used to fire straight up onto rails above you.

Why is it dull? This feature, by itself, sounds exciting. You never give any reasons why you found it dull.

Fast forward to 2 days later; where I find myself sick of the game, oh I’ve completed it and done 2/3s of the challenges.

What does "completed" here mean?

It is as if Contra: Shattered Soldier and Neo Contra didn’t happen.

Neo Contra belongs to an entire different sub-genre. It is therefore natural for the developers of Contra 4 to act as if Neo Contra never happened. I think that sentence would make more sense if it was rewritten as:

It is as if The Hard Corps and Shin Contra (and perhaps also Contra Spirits?) didn’t happen.

My main problem with the review is that there's just a tad bit too much waffling, and not enough analysis of the mechanics. I would like to post this review on the frontpage, or at least another review that would dissect the game's mechanics more expertly. So the thing is, do you think you can take into consideration all the comments posted in this thread, as well as Ed's comment on your site, and rewrite the review to be more analytic and comprehensive with the mechanics?

If not, perhaps someone else could help us? I would be doing it myself if I had a DS right now, but it's in another country and I am not going to buy a second one.

Still, I would like to have a review of this game on the site, so if LaserGun or any other(s) would like to help out in this, let me know in this thread.

[Doctor Fugue]

I haven't posted here since I joined, but that's because I generally have nothing interesting I care to add. However, I do know Contra 4 quite well (1CC easy and normal, all challenges complete, all "unlockables" unlocked, multiplayer credit-fed to the end).

The review does need more description and less talk about whether it succeeds or fails simply based on its attempt to be like an old game. What follows is not a review, but hopefully raises some points that could be discussed in a more thorough discussion of the game.

The hook mechanic, although borne out of necessity (jumping across the gap between screens would become intolerable), is actually quite good. It provides the exciting opportunity for last-minute saves while falling toward certain death, the large-scale upward movement helps make the entire playfield an option for escape, and it feels downright manly! I think it fits perfectly in the Contra universe and deserves to be in future games.

The gap between screens should definitely be discussed at length. It damn near breaks this game. The angle and position of enemy bullets are extremely difficult to judge as they pass through the gap. Since they are not particularly fast-moving, it is not uncommon to glance toward where you are going and see nothing impeding your path...only to have a bullet burst forth from the gap as you climb into its trajectory. The second stage even has the occasional enemy completely hidden in the hinge as they crawl in and remain motionless there. (I would be willing to hear arguments that they are intended to be hidden.)

Another potentially game-breaking problem is that of poor respawn placement. There are a couple of areas (the hanging parts in The City being the worst offender) where, when you die, you are brought back to life in a position to the left of your point of death. In those parts of The City stage, there are ropes over pits of fire. If you die and the screen has scrolled slightly to the right during your death animation, the rope from which you might hang will disappear to the left, leaving you to reappear over a pit of fire. Several times in a row, in fact. You will die through no fault of your own, nor any test of difficulty. I have been through there numerous times (surely more than two hundred) and this has happened about fifteen times. Not a certainty, but an unforgivable death trap nonetheless.

There are many other things to go on about at length. The pros and cons of the weapon powerup system, the balance (or imbalance) of the weapons, the enemy placement and questionable level design (the Factory is terrible), and several others. Surely the lack of interesting bosses save one or two must be mentioned...why do they only have two attacks that merely repeat over and over?

Personally, I wish a new Contra would expand on the increasing amount of Treasure-ness from the older games (for the lack of a better term). Insane multi-part bosses, screen-shaking explosions and a general sense of "Holy shit, I've never played anything like this," are all missing. True, they may have been trying to capture the feel of the first Contra (that is, less emphasis on bosses), but in Contra 4 these huge bosses rise up out of the ground and bore the hell out of me. You might think they were going to do something awesome, but then the boss just swings his arms.

Contra 4 does indeed feel like a fan-made game that only exists to ignite nostalgia. There is nothing wrong with that as long as the game itself is tight, polished and fun, but this is not. Instead it actually comes across as being almost light-hearted; a send-up of Contra. "Ha ha, we made a game that looks like Contra; killing lots of aliens is good 1980s action fun, ho ho ho, remember when we thought this was cool?!" It still is cool, jerks.

To be honest, this is a fault of hiring American developers that are quite possibly just a bunch of frat boys. Their tone is not serious enough; it does not match with the original Japanese sensibility. Of course, this is a much bigger issue that requires a separate book, but it is interesting that when the Japanese make a game with obvious references to American action movies, the result is not satire or parody. Somehow, other people perceive irony that does not exist.

Back to Contra 4...there are some excellent qualities outside of the core game. The challenges are fun and addictive (limited ammo, no ammo, don't kill the hostages) and there are lots of things to unlock. Other character sprites, a museum containing art and descriptions of previous Contra games, an interview, and playable versions of the original NES versions of Contra and Super C (single-player only). I haven't played much of the emulated games so I don't know if they are accurate.

I must say that since 1CCing the game last year, I haven't played it at all. I wouldn't even really recommend it to anyone as it is just not very fun. Play Hard Corps instead.

[JoshF]

If you added an introduction and a paragraph on the basics I think that would be the review right there.

[icycalm]

So I took the liberty of blending LaserGun's and Doctor Fugue's reviews into a single be-all end-all review of Contra 4:

http://insomnia.ac/reviews/ds/contra4/

I haven't edited it properly yet (there are still a couple of rough spots, no screenshots, etc.), but I wanted to get the approval of both authors before spending any more time on it. Note that having two people review a game is not unprecedented, at least not on this site:

http://insomnia.ac/reviews/atomiswave/t ... ightersxi/

And there have been other reviews (Arcana Heart and Lost Odyssey, for example) which contain significant contributions (like, entire paragraphs) from other people, even though uncredited.

Note also that I don't find the review too long, just in case anyone thinks of raising this objection. The trend of handing venerable Japanese franchises over to incompetent Western developers to butcher them is a very common one these days, and no one is really addressing it seriously, so in-depth reviews like this are really important, and should be encouraged. Recap has already addressed the aesthetic aspect of many of these "updates" (see here), but no one has really tackled the mechanical part, and there is no better place to do that than in reviews of individual examples.

The only other thing I have to ask is whether Doctor Fugue would like to expand on this:

There are many other things to go on about at length. The pros and cons of the weapon powerup system, the balance (or imbalance) of the weapons, the enemy placement and questionable level design (the Factory is terrible), and several others.

and also whether he agrees with LaserGun's rating for the game (2/5). From reading their reviews I'd say they agree on pretty much everything apart from the grappling hook issue, but here is Insomnia's rating system once more, just in case:

***** Highly recommended
**** Recommended
*** Good, but has been done before, and much better
** Playable, but without much merit
* LOL

It is clear that this is either a two- or three-star game, and, quite frankly, it doesn't much matter which rating the game gets. The ratings should be taken with a grain of salt anyway, since there are over twenty people reviewing games for this site, and their standards will of course never quite coincide. So factoring a plus/minus one-star divergence into every rating is a good idea. The ratings are anyway mostly for indexing purposes than anything else. Still, it's a good idea to be as consistent as possible, and to try and decide whether Contra 4 ranks more alongside games like Cyborg Justice, Sonic The Hedgehog 2, Shin Chuka Taisen, New Super Mario Bros., Arrow Flash, etc. (two stars), or The Legend of Kage 2, Gunstar Heroes and Super Heroes, Michael Jackson's Moonkwalker, Sega's Disney games, etc. (three stars).

[LaserGun]

You have my approval to combine both of our reviews into one.

I must add (this is a reply to your earlier post), that my review was pretty much rushed out in 2 hours after setting up my blog, so it wouldn't look so bare. As a result, I didn't spend much time elaborating on game's mechanics (grappling hook) like I did with my GCCX review (which took 10 hours to write).

I'll leave Doctor Fugue to expand on some of the game's mechanics further, if he feels necessary, he seems more suited to the task than I am right now, to be honest. About the rating, you won't find me giving many DS games more than a 2. If we're going by Insomnia's rating system, then the game does deserve a 3, due to the fact that it isn't the worst game in the Contra series, it is just painfully average compared to better games in the series.

[Doctor Fugue]

Unfortunately the weapon system has resurrected the original Contra's preferential treatment of the spread gun. With this weapon fully powered, the game becomes almost a walk in the park. Since the spread gun is the best weapon for nearly the entire game (both scrolling and corridor levels), there is little reason to consider using other guns or continuing your credit after losing the spread weapon.

There is good variety and length among the scrolling stages. Aside from a jungle, demolished city and harbour port, there is an epic final stage in lair of the aliens that is more than twice the length of any other stage. The trend of alternating styles of level returns with corridor running base stages from the first Contra, as well as a stage on hoverbikes. These levels are as boring as they are unnecessary. If the normal stages were better, there would be no need to deviate from them.

[Cut this next bit out if it sounds like total bullshit; perhaps I'm not describing it well enough]

In well-made games that require a fair amount of memorization to survive or score well, eventually the level design and enemy placement will reveal itself to be a carefully laid plan by the developers. After many credits, the player hopefully will come to understand the intricate construction of a game that rewards patience. Contra 4 is not one of those games. The pace never achieves a great sense of constant flow; stretches of boredom are interrupted by moments of frustrating difficulty. The result is not enjoyable, even after mastering the game.


Two stars is fine with me. I wouldn't argue with three, either, but that might be generous.

Please feel free to use my name: Dominic Florence. I don't know how you feel about academic (not medical) titles; I use "Dr." professionally, but it is quite irrelevant here. I don't care either way.

[icycalm]

Okay, it's up. I couldn't think up anything for the frontpage snippet, so I just ripped off Tim's comments. I wonder if he'll remember them when he sees them!

Note that I did not include these comments:

There is good variety and length among the scrolling stages. Aside from a jungle, demolished city and harbour port, there is an epic final stage in lair of the aliens that is more than twice the length of any other stage.

... because they are not saying much of substance, especially considering the fact you are spoiling the game as well. Spoiling the game is not a faux pas in reviews, you can do it if your criticisms depend on it, but there has to be a decent trade off, and this is lacking here.

Also this:

The trend of alternating styles of level returns with corridor running base stages from the first Contra, as well as a stage on hoverbikes. These levels are as boring as they are unnecessary. If the normal stages were better, there would be no need to deviate from them.

The corridor stages might suck, but that doesn't validate the last sentence. There are many games with "variety" stages, which, though the game might not "need" them per se, are still solid, enjoyable, and provide a nice break from the action. Shadow Dancer and The Super Shinobi II come immediately to mind (and even the car-smashing stages from the first Street Fighters!), and there are many many others.

Also, many other random edits have been made all over the place, so read the whole thing again to be sure I've not bungled anything. And if any other comments/corrections/additions occur to either of the authors at any time, just post them in this thread and I'll be happy to edit the review with them.

One thing no one spoke about was the graphics. Is it too much of a crime to say that I can't see much wrong with them? Looking at these screenshots, and having not played a 2D Contra game since the early '90s (I played Shin, but it wasn't 2D), I can even say I like them. In fact, they make me want to play the game!

Please feel free to use my name: Dominic Florence. I don't know how you feel about academic (not medical) titles; I use "Dr." professionally, but it is quite irrelevant here. I don't care either way.

That will be fun: "A review by Dr. Dominic Florence, professor of FUN!" I should also start using a title. "Sir Alex Kierkegaard" perhaps, or "Alex Kierkegaard, 1st Baronet" or something.

[icycalm]

I wonder why they saw fit to give the illustrations the anime treatment for Japan:



Contra was never anime-styled, was it?

[Recap]

Recap has already addressed the aesthetic aspect of many of these "updates" (see here), but no one has really tackled the mechanical part, and there is no better place to do that than in reviews of individual examples.

I don't care enough to play them. I think I tried Contra 4 for about 40 seconds. I couldn't even keep playing to finish a simple play. A freaking handheld for Contra? You must be kidding. Not to mention the fake double-screen action -- "fake" for the space between both screens, of course. Haven't seen a DS game which evidences so well the retardedness of this hardware "feature".

A shame the review (both of them) doesn't even mention it.

One thing no one spoke about was the graphics. Is it too much of a crime to say that I can't see much wrong with them? Looking at these screenshots, and having not played a 2D Contra game since the early '90s (I played Shin, but it wasn't 2D), I can even say I like them. In fact, they make me want to play the game!

What they say about the mechanics can very well be applied to the graphics: they're fan-quality material. The rehash of the sprites from Spirits and the pretense of capturing its style for moments is... amateurish, in a candid way. Nieborg's work is not suitable for this series and it shows.

Contra was never anime-styled, was it?

Akumajou Dracula never was either and there you have it.

[Recap]

so I just ripped off Tim's comments.

About that, you do know that Nakazato had nothing to do with the original Contras for the arcades and that indeed Contra lost an important part of its identity with his appearance, right?

[JoshF]

The Predator/Giger ripoff parts we've seen in a million other games?

[Recap]

You mean military instead of mecha, jungle instead of post-apocalyptic cities, washed colors instead of Saturday Night Live tones? Then yep.

Konami pioneered in that and made the trend like no other, anyway.

[Doctor Fugue]

Thanks icycalm for taking the time and effort to edit it together.

Fourth paragraph from the end, the eighth word should be "to."

I guess it didn't really occur to me to mention it, but the graphics are nice, and it moves smoothly (corridor levels are ugly, though). Still, too restrained somehow, I'd like more insanity.

I also forgot to mention there are two pretty cool comic books that are unlockable. Well, not entire books; I don't know what to call them.

I like good bonus stages, but I can't stand games with two different kinds of main stages. I imagine someone who actually likes the corridor crap from the original game might like it in Contra 4.

[icycalm]

Typo fixed. Thanks for pointing it out.

About that, you do know that Nakazato had nothing to do with the original Contras for the arcades and that indeed Contra lost an important part of its identity with his appearance, right?

It depends on how you see it. Sure, it lost part of its identity, but it acquired a new part of a new identity. The point is which identity you prefer. After reading Rando's analysis of the issue, and judging mostly by that because my experience with the actual games is very limited, I'd say I prefer the new identity over the old.

[Recap]

Isn't he agreeing with me, essentially? I like the fact that he mentions the word "drama". That's another crucial difference between Nakazato and pre-Nakazato when talking about aesthetics and theme. Pre-Nakazato did indeed focus on the dramatic content, and the visuals and the "scene development" were designed to emphazise the drama. Spirits and Hard Corps adopted a more childish and generic premise, particularly the latter with all its anime-inspired motifs.

So it's not a matter of what you prefer. If (part of) the identity is lost with a new episode, then its authors missed the point or just failed. It's indeed my main critcism here, beyond the polygon uglyfication and whatnot.

[icycalm]

You are not paying attention to what I said:

Sure, it lost part of its identity, but it acquired a new part of a new identity. The point is which identity you prefer.

In other words, I am glad it lost part of its identity, because I like the new one more. This sort of thing happens often with long-running series involving multiple authors. It's only natural. If someone gave me a new Batman to direct, I sure as hell would go in an entirely new direction than anyone else before me, with a new tone, etc. Of course, those who preferred, say, the gay tone of some of the TV series, would find my Batman a sacrilege, but hey, that's how life works. I have no problem with that. If they want the series to maintain the exact same tone, they should try and keep on board the original authors. Aping someone else's style usually leads to second-rate work anyway.

[icycalm]

Just a note: this game has not yet been released in Euroland for some reason.

[icycalm]

Macaw has thrown down the gauntlet!

http://www.gamengai.com/forum/viewtopic ... 836#p26836

Off topic, but I recently messed around a bit more with DS emulators and rotating my monitor and have pulled of a decent enough setup.

So anyone else with me on thinking that Contra 4 is the best in the series? The use of the vertical screen is amazing, especially with the boss battles like the stage 2 boss which is jaw dropping when playing the game on a tate'd monitor, along with plenty of other moments.

The only problem I have is the fact its a fuckn DS game. What is absolutely amazing on a vertical monitor is just 'pretty cool' on the little screens, it just kinda sucks that you have to use a emulator and rotated monitor to get the full experience from the game, yet ultimately people still would have mostly played it on a shitty little DS.

The controls are also pretty important for the game because of the sky high difficulty, playing on a DS is a nightmare in that regard. I can understand why the game got so much flak for difficulty when it was released when its a tonne harder than arcade Super Contra but everyones stuck playing it on the little DS screens and the crap controls.

Theres also the issue of the huge dead zone between the screens. In an emulator you can simulate the gap between screens which is cool, but playing with the screens connected like in shou's screenshot would be practically impossible.

So basically an Arcade port of the game for tate monitors would have been the greatest thing ever, but still doing a tate emulator setup is freaking amazing. I really hope wayforward provide some kind of console re-release of the game in the future with tate available and no dead zone.

So anyone else with me on thinking that Contra 4 is the best in the series?

Absolutely not. It doesn't hold a candle to the Famicom ports, Hard Corps, Shin Contra or Neo Contra. It's not even that difficult if you don't rush through the stages, and the boss designs are seriously lacking. At best, it's an above-average doujin game that managed to get the license.

Those reviews are absolute trash by people absolutely obsessed with the fact that game isn't Japanese developed and therefore must suck and probably know fuck all about Contra.

The game is harder than all other contra games period, anyone that thinks otherwise has not tried to 1cc it and doesn't know what their talking about.

The bosses are cooler than in any of the Japanese titles, the wall in stage 1, demon in stage 2, and endless insanity in stage 4 are incredible. The fact you say this game doesn't hold a candle to the 8 bit nes ports and those ps2 fares is ludicrous. The only game that comes close is Hard Corps.

And when it comes to exciting level design stuff like stage 4 once again blows away the Japanese titles. Nothing is crazier and more exhilarating than that.

People who give the game shit need to get further than just the stage 1 jungle, and preferably play the game in an emulator with proper controls and screen size and shit.

Hey guys lets compare:

Alien wall in nes contra: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUXfQpbYG58

Alien wall in Contra 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoBwQeUM2OM



I better go play the nes game instead, its obviously superior! hahahahahah

That he calls the Insomnia review "absolute trash" (which it obviously isn't), instead of simply saying he disagrees with certain points, etc. etc. is a dead giveaway to me that he is butthurt about me showing him his place in the Real-time Strategy vs. City-building thread [ > ] recently and simply seizing the first opportunity to lash out against the site, and I am slowly coming to the realization that what is absolute trash here is his knowledge and understanding of videogames. We've been laughing with other staff members for years here about how he seems to love almost everything, but so far it's been merely cute and not in any way annoying. Now that he's turning malignant, it's a different story. It's okay to gush over every single fucking obscure (and DESERVEDLY so!) crappy little game of the entire early-console and home computer libraries of the planet, as long as no one gives a shit about these games and your cute frothing shenanigans are helping increase awareness of how truly vast these libraries are; but when you move into the proper game category, and try to trash the efforts of real critics with zero arguments to back up your wild claims (and even with complete ignorance and outright lies, as seen in the RTS vs. City-building thread), you've crossed a line fucker. Your shenanigans are no longer cute but offensive and annoying.

In the case of Contra 4, I'll say this much: I played maybe 10 minutes of the game when it came out, and those 10 minutes were enough to see that it was vastly inferior to at least Contra Spirits and Shin Contra, which I have played extensively. I can't talk about the Famicom games because I haven't played them, and I can't talk about the first two arcade games, because I've only played the first one a little bit. Perhaps Pretas is right in placing 4 beneath them, or perhaps he's reading things into the Insomnia review that aren't there and overreaching himself. Either way, that's only details to what is the point here. And the point here is that, even if PART of Macaw's claims are correct, that still doesn't excuse his rude blanket dismissal of Insomnia's entire review, nor does it excuse the absurdity of the THE OTHER PART of his ludicrous claims. On top of the fact that his main point is kinda moot because the best Contra game is obviously Uprising, which he of course hasn't played because he's too busy speedrushing through all those rubbish romsets.

I am really disappointed with this kid. But then again I am really disappointed with Recap, Vito Gesualdi, the Scathing Accuracy guys, Cacophanus, Sullla, and so many other people that if I started listing them I'd have to copy-paste the entire list of contributors here. You just have to figure out each person's limitations and try to ignore and overlook them as much as possible, while taking from them everything that's good and great from what they have to give. The difference is that all these guys at least HAVE something to give, whereas the journalists and vast majority of fans and bloggers have nothing. It's just too bad they lack the sense to realize when they've overstepped their boundaries and should keep their mouths shut. Things would be much less aggravating then, and we wouldn't be forced to go into all this unpleasantness where I call out their bullshit and call them names and put them in their places. But c'est la vie I guess. I guess it would be too much to ask of them to know, not only the 5 things they do know, but also the infinity of things they don't know. The "known unknowns" so to speak. They should ask Rumsfeld about that lol.