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Unread postby icycalm » 08 Sep 2022 03:48

Ah, you can't direct-link. You need to click on "Prices" at the top-left. The most expensive ship is the Javelin for $3,000.
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Unread postby icycalm » 08 Sep 2022 03:50

Image

There are much bigger ones, this is just the biggest civilians can buy.

It's not in the game yet. They need to put in the mechanics first, like engineering, resource management etc.
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Unread postby Adjudicator » 08 Sep 2022 04:12

Note that the very expensive ships are extremely limited purchases.

Only Concierge-class accounts—those that have spent at least USD 1000 into the game get to even have the opportunity to pledge for some of these "limited capital ships" through the Concierge pledge store.

The two examples being the Idris-P class stripped down "war surplus" Frigates (Current Price: USD 1500, Warbond Price: USD 1300) and the Javelin class Destroyers (USD 3500, Warbond Price USD 2700).

This is explained in-universe as rules and restrictions in the arms industry being loosened but still restricted, and the popularity of the full military spec Idris-M making the Aegis Dynamics company reopen the production line of the Idris class to construct new Idris-P frigates to meet the demand.

EDIT: Just saw a Reddit thread that details two methods how can non-concierge members access the concierge store to buy one of the super-expensive items and get concierge status without needing the prior investment into the game.

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/co ... buying_an/

To summarise:

1st Method: Take advantage of the 30-day full refund grace period. Purchase items to raise your pledge level to USD 1000, unlock Concierge store, purchase the limited item, then ask a refund for the other orders used to reach Concierge status.

2nd Method: Ask customer service to open the Concierge store. Note that it takes time for the customer service to respond. This has to be done in advance before the limited quantity item is sold out.
Last edited by Adjudicator on 08 Sep 2022 04:30, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread postby Adjudicator » 08 Sep 2022 04:20

This Eurogamer article from 2014 summarizes the working real money trading/gifting real money items in Star Citizen: https://www.eurogamer.net/inside-star-c ... rey-market
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Unread postby Adjudicator » 20 Sep 2022 18:24

Continued from here: https://culture.vg/forum/topic?p=35868#p35868

icycalm wrote:Image

I bought the RSI Scorpius off a reseller site for $260 including a sick LE paint scheme, pictured above. Weirdly, I also received another ship in the game which I hadn't ordered, though it's not showing on my account on the RSI website. So perhaps it is a bug, or some kind of trial version, so I am not adding it here for the time being. Very cool ship too, apparently, "The closest to the Military load-out as is legally possible for a Civilian model": https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pled ... per-hornet


icycalm, what is seen in your profile is an example of a "pledge Ship Upgrade" (Previously known as "Cross Chassis Upgrade" (CCU)". Pledged ships can be upgraded to a higher value ship, but not downgraded or sidegraded.

The end product is the RSI Scorpius, but the genealogy and history of the pledge from the other user, started as an Anvil Hornet. The original owner pledged for an Anvil Hornet, then upgraded one or more times, with the final result being the RSI Scorpius.

Note that the RSI Scorpius, being a post 2020 launch ship, can never have Lifetime Insurance naturally on it, unless at least one chassis it was pledge upgraded from has Lifetime Insurance, or the former owner applied a legacy (No longer sold) pledge store item "Lifetime Insurance Token" into this upgrade package.

This ties in to why would a player want to own multiples of a single ship despite spawn limits - some of them are used as bases or are the midpoint of a "Pledge Ship Upgrade" chain, stacking warbond or real money sales discounts on the way.

Further details can be read at the official website on (real-money) Ship Upgrades:

https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... ades-CCUs-

This official warning must be read and understood before managing your pledges:

Roberts Space Industries Knowledge Base Game Support Pledges, Packages, and Ships wrote:Important! All ship upgrades are permanent. Once upgraded, a ship cannot be reverted back to its previous state. The only way to revert an upgraded ship is to potentially reclaim your pledge then buy it back. This strips all upgrades on the ship and forcefully returns the original ship with the pledge.
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Unread postby icycalm » 20 Sep 2022 18:36

I don't see the Hornet on my profile, I see it in my vehicle selection screen in the game. This is what my profile shows for the Scorpius:

Image

There is no Hornet either here, or in the rest of my profile items.
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Unread postby Adjudicator » 20 Sep 2022 19:03

Thank you for that screen capture, icycalm. I am now able to appraise and identify the nature and history of the pledge.

This appears to be a simple ship upgrade chain - two links only, as there are two insurance policies in this pledge upgrade chain. Click on the blue icon beside the pledge gift to see the upgrade chain breakdown and when were the upgrades applied.

The base pledge is a Mule vehicle. A Ship Upgrade costing the difference between the Mule to the RSI Scorpius has been applied to it, turning the Mule to the RSI Scorpius. Two possibilities exist:

Upon doing more research, I realise the Scorpius was sold a few times even before the recent Ship Showdown 2022 that concluded in mid September. The first sales of the RSI Scorpius in May 2021 (Invictus Launch Week 2951 Concept Warbond sale) were discounted (Analogous to a Steam game Pre-release pre-order 10% discount) came with Lifetime Insurance.

Given the sequence pattern of the insurance policies (LTI first, 120 month next), it is more likely the previous owner purchased a Mule with Lifetime Insurance to use as a pledge upgrade base, then bought an RSI Scorpius ship upgrade during a sales period where the Scorpius came with the unique paint, then applied it to the original pledge mule and turned it into an RSI Scorpius with the paint.

Once the pledge upgrade history icon is clicked to reveal the upgrade log, I can complete the appraisal.

EDIT: For information, the initial sales release of the RSI Scorpius reads like an in-universe advertisement and even has a downloadable brochure.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm ... I-Scorpius
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Unread postby icycalm » 20 Sep 2022 19:23

It's a long list.

Sep 19 2022, 9:35 pm
Upgrade applied: #39657327 Upgrade - Corsair to Scorpius Standard Edition, new value: $195.00 USD
Sep 19 2022, 9:35 pm
Upgrade applied: #42072666 Upgrade - Constellation Taurus to Corsair Standard Edition, new value: $190.00 USD
Sep 19 2022, 9:35 pm
Upgrade applied: #42072721 Upgrade - Vulture to Constellation Taurus Standard Edition, new value: $165.00 USD
Sep 19 2022, 9:35 pm
Upgrade applied: #40351435 Upgrade - F7C-S Hornet Ghost to Vulture Warbond Edition, new value: $115.00 USD
Sep 19 2022, 9:34 pm
Upgrade applied: #42072720 Upgrade - Hull A to F7C-S Hornet Ghost Standard Edition, new value: $110.00 USD
Sep 19 2022, 9:34 pm
Upgrade applied: #39669548 Upgrade - Arrow to Hull A Warbond Edition, new value: $75.00 USD
Sep 19 2022, 9:34 pm
Upgrade applied: #42072719 Upgrade - Mule to Arrow Standard Edition, new value: $70.00 USD

What I don't understand is why I have the Hornet in the game. I don't have any of these ships in my game, not even the Mule. But I have the Hornet...
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 20 Sep 2022 20:09

Maybe it's a loaner? But a loaner for what? My Scorpius is already in the game. They say loaners are comparable ships they loan you if your ship hasn't been added to the game yet, but mine has been in for a few months.

Must be some kind of glitch.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby Adjudicator » 20 Sep 2022 20:40

Wow. That is one very long Ship Upgrade chain (previously known as a Cross-Chassis Upgrade - CCU).

The Real Money pledged value (also known as "Melt Value") of the pledge is USD 195. This is the amount of pledge store credit this upgrade chain is worth, despite the true value of the RSI Scorpius being more than that.

The original owner compounded multiple discounts by planning a "CCU chain" - the term used by grey market/real money pledge resellers for this kind of complicated "discount upgrade" mechanics.

This Reddit thread best explains this: https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/co ... _like_im_a

It's a combination of two features in the RSI store:

1. Warbond; is a ship that can only be purchased with new money. The alternative is "Standard", which can be bought with new money or store credit you get from melting ships you don't want anymore. Warbond always offers a small discount on the price so a ship that is usually $250 Standard might be $230 Warbond.

2. CCU; is a cross Chassis Upgrade. Simply put, you can use the current Standard value of a ship you've bought to upgrade to a more expensive ship and only pay the difference. I highlight "Standard" because even if you bought the above ship at $230 with Warbond, its CCU value is still $250.

Now, the chain is when there are multiple ships, all with Warbond. You can start with a low cost ship, buy a Warbond CCU to a higher price ship, then another CCU to an even higher price ship, and continue as long as there are discounted Warbond ships available. Each new CCU will subtract its savings compared to the Standard from the total price while keeping the Standard value for upgrading it again. So you end up with a "stack" of discounts equal to the total discounts of all the Warbond ships in your chain.

The other method of saving money is to have a ship you purchased before its Standard price went up. You'll get the new value towards the next upgrade.

The downside is if you ever melt this "stack" you lose all of the saved value because you can't recover a CCU once applied. You'll only get the store credit equivalent to the total you paid or the "melt value". This is why people will often show off a very low melt value on an expensive ship to prove they made a really good CCU chain.


For the Anvil Hornet, I found the answer with more research.

The RSI Scorpius, in its current incarnation (NOT fully flight ready - cannot be purchased with credits in game), is incomplete and lacks its full features.

The Anvil F7C-M Super Hornet is given as a developer "Loan Ship" stand-in for those who pledged an RSI Scorpius.

There is an official game support page elaborating on "Loaner ships": https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... hip-Matrix

Roberts Space Industries Knowledge Base wrote:Have you found yourself in possession of a pledge with a ship that's not yet Flight Ready? We've got you covered, providing you with a loaner ship to ensure that you are able to fly inside the current version of Star Citizen Alpha.

Below is our Loaner Ship Matrix that currently has all ships not available in the PU (Persistent Universe) and their respective loaners until that ship becomes "Flight Ready."

There are a couple of points to note about this list:

The concept of "ship loaners" was introduced to allow players who owned a game package and a single ship to play the game when that ship was unavailable. The loaners for each ship are not intended to be a 1:1 "best case substitute" for the ship that isn't flight ready.
The presence of a valid game package is required for loaners to be granted to an account.
If a new ship becomes Flight Ready and is a better substitute, the loaner will be updated.
Due to the current restrictions in Arena Commander, certain ships have a secondary loaner to allow them to play in all game modes. For example, Freelancer owners receive an Anvil Arrow for use in Arena Commander play modes.
These are not permanent additions to your fleet. Once a ship on this list is Flight Ready, the loaner will be replaced by the ship you purchased and removed from this thread.
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Aegis Javelin can be obtained for free

Unread postby Adjudicator » 22 Sep 2022 17:10

icycalm wrote:Ah, you can't direct-link. You need to click on "Prices" at the top-left. The most expensive ship is the Javelin for $3,000.


Note that the Aegis Javelin-class destroyer can be theoretically obtained by a player's account without needing to pay for anything except a base game package.

The account simply needs to have successfully referred enough new players that end up buying a game package of at least US$40 (2017 new users using the account's referral code).

Further details on the Star Citizen Referral Program are at this link:

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/referral-program

The referral tier and reward in question:

Lt. General - 2017 RP*

Star Crossing
Voyage across the ‘verse in commanding fashion with the Aegis Javelin, one of the UEE Navy’s premier warships
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 22 Sep 2022 17:28

2017 referrals are too many. If you look at the list of top referrers, only about 6-7 people have managed this many so far. There's no way I could do this, for example. On the other hand, it makes sense not to hand out Javelins like cookies, so it's a good balance they've found there.

More interesting to me is the 1042 referrals level. That's still impossible for me, but it should be possible for a couple dozen people. It grants them access to an exclusive in-game club! I wonder where that club is.

Million Mile High Club Access
Party at the trendiest club in the ‘verse. The Million Mile High Club is an exclusive, in-game facility for the most dedicated Star Citizen fans.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby Adjudicator » 09 Oct 2022 04:11

The latest Star Citizen Alpha 3.17.3 for the Halloween themed and CitizenCon 2952 events has been out since 6th October 2022.

When I logged in this morning, I saw two announcements for new Warbond purchases (significantly discounted pledges, but can only be purchased with real money, not store credit from pledge refunds) for those interested in purchasing ships at the concept art stage.

The first set of newly-revealed ships in the patch notes links is the Crusader Spirit series.

The Crusader A1 Spirit is the multi-role fighter bomber that also has a small vehicle access ramp in the rear. It costs USD 155 after Warbond discount (USD 175 base price).

Purchasing this concept ship provides a MISC Freelancer MIS (cargo ship that sacrifices some cargo space for more missile racks) as a temporary loan ship.

The Crusader C1 Spirit is the pure cargo-carrying variant with a rear tractor beam and a vehicle and cargo access ramp. It costs USD 100 after Warbond discount (USD 110 base price).

Purchasing this concept ship provides a Drake Cutlass Black (jack of all trades medium cargo/vehicle carrier ship) as a temporary loan ship.

The Crusader E1 Spirit is the Executive Private Spacecraft "Business Jet" variant with a rear tractor beam and a vehicle and cargo access ramp. It costs USD 135 after Warbond discount (USD 150 base price).

Purchasing this concept ship provides a Drake Cutlass Steel (infantry dropship) as a temporary loan ship.

Purchasing all three ships as a package (Spirit collection) can be done for USD 370 Warbond (USD 410 Base price).

Links: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm ... -A1-Spirit

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm ... -C1-Spirit

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm ... -E1-Spirit

Crusader Spirit technical sheet summary: https://media.robertsspaceindustries.co ... source.pdf

I am looking forward to the Crusader E1 Spirit.

I remember when the CULT organisation agreed to used my Vanguard Sentinel's interior and turret as an impromptu bus to ferry players in bulk to Orison, Crusader for the Nine Tails siege event. It was not meant to do that and it was not a comfortable experience.

The Crusader E1 Executive transport is likely a similar size profile as the Vanguard series, but with more proper seats and amenities for its passengers.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby Adjudicator » 10 Oct 2022 11:28

For those who are interested in purchasing the recently released Greycat STV, or the above-mentioned Crusader Spirit series from the pledge store, do note that there are Warbond versions of these pledges available, that can only be bought with pledging additional money and not from store credit from reclaiming existing pledges.

You can access the Warbond pledges directly from the advertising-specific page from the Star Citizen RSI Launcher update links and scroll down to find them.

Greycat STV announcement link: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm ... reycat-STV

Or if using the pledge store, you need to ensure that the bold text "Warbond version pledges CANNOT be purchased with store credit" is indicated.

The Warbond pledge of the STV not only comes with a discounted price of USD35 (base price of USD 40), but also the coveted Lifetime Insurance (LTI) status symbol. I have attached a screen capture highlighting the Warbond pledge indicator and the lifetime insurance in red.

Image

If a player wants to participate in grey market trading, the Warbond edition STV is invaluable in the future since it can be used to start an upgrade/discount chain due to its low base real money cost allowing its Lifetime Insurance to be inherited by whatever vehicle the STV is upgraded to.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby Adjudicator » 10 Oct 2022 12:14

For those who have made wrong purchases from the Star Citizen pledge store, there are two methods to undo or minimise the damage.

1. If it is within 30 days of the pledge, the pledge can be refunded via lodging a support ticket: https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... efunds-FAQ

2. The other method is to reclaim the pledge for store credit that can be used to purchase non-Warbond pledges. This can be done anytime with pledged ships, subject to terms and conditions.

This can get complicated due to interactions of reclaimed pledges, store credit, pledge buyback, and store credit buyback tokens, coupled with changes in ship price as features and capabilities are added or removed from ships as part of balancing, bug fixes, feature creep, resizing etc.

Reclaiming unwanted pledges: https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... m-a-Pledge

Using pledge store credit: https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... ore-Credit

Buying back reclaimed pledges: https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... -Back-tool
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 10 Oct 2022 19:09

Thanks for the detailed info Adjudicator.

What happened with me is that when I saw that the Warbond version of the STV was CHEAPER, I presumed that I wouldn't be allowed to buy it because I am not a Concierge member. I vaguely remembered you saying that some of the deals were only available to Concierge members, and I didn't bother to go back and reread your posts in detail. I just googled for "STV LTI" and bought it from a reseller.

It didn't make sense to me why the better version of the vehicle would be CHEAPER, so I assumed I wasn't allowed to buy it lol. But now that you explained that the cheaper version doesn't allow store credit, it makes a bit of sense. Not too much sense though, because store credit is still money. Steam for example doesn't differentiate between new money and store credit, so I am not sure what CIG is gaining by this differentiation.

Anyway thanks for clearing this up.

What bothers me about this transaction is that I think money spent on resellers doesn't count towards the $1,000 threshold that gets you into Concierge. So if I had bought the vehicle on the official store, I'd be $40 closer to Concierge. Same with my $250 Scorpius purchase, though I think the Scorpius isn't sold in the store at all currently, so resellers were my only option.

A bummer because with all the paints, and an armor I've bought, and the two vehicles, I'd be nearing $400 by now.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 10 Oct 2022 19:18

War Bonds: https://www.investopedia.com/terms/w/warbonds.asp

Investopedia wrote:A war bond is a debt security issued by a government to finance military operations during times of war or conflict. Because war bonds offered a rate of return below the market rate, investment was achieved by making emotional appeals to patriotic citizens to lend the government money.


Just a tidbit I googled. It's two words in the real world.

I like how they've gone the extra mile to make even their P2W scheme sound vaguely in-lore/immersive. At first it sounds like a bullshit term, but there's been thought put into it.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 10 Oct 2022 19:48

After a bit more thinking I figured it out.

Warbond mechanics encourage you to buy new vehicles instead of "melting" and combining existing ones to upgrade, if you want Lifetime Insurance. The tiny Warbond discount isn't the object of the exercise, it's merely a thin veil of justification that CIG uses to cover... their greed basically lmao. Steam has none of these mechanics, and that's why their store credit is equal to new money.

Their whole scheme is exceptionally well-designed, just like the game. I've spent close to $400 in two months and I didn't mean to spend anything. I am pretty sure I'll get into Concierge at some point. I love it.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 28 Oct 2022 08:29

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/co ... &context=3

logicalChimp wrote:For reference, CIG have four categories of ships:

  • Common - these ships are always on sale
  • Uncommon - these ships are only sold intermittently (usually during events)
  • Rare - these ships are only sold intermittently (usually during events), and only in strictly limited numbers (once they're gone, they're gone... until the next event)
  • Not Sold - ships that CIG have said will never be sold (or never sold again)

Any ship that is 'in concept' (ie not yet flyable in-game) will automatically be classed as 'uncommon', although some will be classed as 'rare'. Once they become flyable, some will become 'common', depending on how CIG see their role in the overall PU, etc (inc. NPC usage).

Ships in the 'Not Sold' category include ships that were part of a promotion (e.g. AMD Mustang, Intel Sabre), or are no longer sold (such as the Vanduul Scythe). Some ships are also effectively in this category, because they're only available in packs costing $10,000 or more.

Edit: changed 'unobtainable' category to 'Not Sold', because most of those ships are obtainable... just not by buying through the web store.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby Adjudicator » 30 Oct 2022 11:12

While commenting about the Anvil Carrack explorer ship and its USD 1100 UEE Explorer Pack 2950 on the medical mechanics thread [ > ], I also found out the following:

The Carrack is a ship with a lot of controversy in the game's history, since it has been feature-creeped and upsized during development, and its price has increased accordingly.

The original backers of the Carrack back in Kickstarter and other early rounds of funding only had to pay USD 350 for this ship. It has risen in price to USD 500, and now USD 600 over the years.

EDIT: Link to an article from 2014 stating the LTI Carrack going for USD 350: https://www.engadget.com/2014-12-01-sta ... -sale.html

However, keep in mind that your investment does not appreciate as the game pledge system still states your "early backer" Carrack is only worth USD 350.

However, note that you can sell it on the grey market to others for just under the new price.

This "ship feature inflation" is also in effect for another concept ship: The Banu Merchantman.

It was originally envisioned as "Large" size (requiring the same components as the Hercules series and the Anvil Carrack). However, later game updates and announcements envisioned the Banu Merchantman as having shops for rent to other players/NPCs within it, and it was realised that the ship needed to be bigger and reworked.

Consequently, the Merchantman was enlarged to "Capital" size (Idris series, Javelin series) that is still atmosphere- and planet-capable, and through the years, its original pledge price of USD 250 has gone up to USD 300, USD 350, USD 500 as of last year and currently it is now USD 600.

This Reddit post goes into the history of how long the Banu Merchantman has been in development for: https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/co ... erchantman

I find this Reddit post from 23 July 2021 to be enlightening:

myelrecsy wrote:I own a BMM too but sorry, I think we owners are already compensated enough.

- We get to fly around, not only one but at least 2 loaners, and CIG updates it depending on what ship is being released that comes close to the BMM's function or relates to it. We were flying a Caterpillar + Buccaneer before, then Banu Defender got released, they gave us that as a loaner. Then they changed the CAT to the just released C2 Hercules. Imagine that, just released ship and we are flying it.

- It already increased it's price multiple times, now it's $500. It will further increase for sure.

- With all the iterations the other ships are getting right now, we can assume that once they release the BMM, it will have all those iterations on it. It may even release in a 'gold standard' state already.

I admit, it would really be nice to have something free for it, but let's be fair and not post it like a demanding entitled person. More patience sir, you (we) already waited this long, why break now, right? It will come.


Looking back to the ship loaner matrix, that would explain why I can see so many Hercules around the Persistent Universe during events: It is likely that quite a few of them are loaner stand-ins for other pledged ships!
Last edited by Adjudicator on 30 Oct 2022 15:20, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby Adjudicator » 30 Oct 2022 11:24

Another unique advantage of using real cashmoney to buy large ships:

Ship Naming Guide
https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... ming-Guide

You get the right to name them and reserve a unique name for them first, as ship naming is currently only available for pledged ships, with no definitive answer on when will non-cashmoney ships be able to be named.

Before one gets too excited, keep in mind the following:

Cloud Imperium Games wrote:SHIP NAME RESTRICTIONS
Be as creative as you like, but there are a few rules that will need to be followed as outlined here:

A ship's name is unique to that particular model of ship, including any variants.

Example: A 600i and an 890 Jump can both be named the "Touring McTouringson", but two different players cannot both name their 600i the "Touring McTouringson".

Example: A 600i Explorer, Touring, and Executive edition are all grouped under the 600i series and so they must have unique names.

Names are on a "First Come, First Served" basis.

There is a limit of 32 characters for a given ship name that must consist of ASCII characters of non-accented letters, numbers, spaces, and/or dashes in any combination.

Spaces and dashes, while allowed, cannot be consecutively repeated in the ship's name and cannot be on the outside of the name.

Example: A ship named "Proud-Mary" is fine but "Proud--Mary" and "-Proud-Mary-" are not.

The ship name must respect the RSI Code of Conduct and Terms of Service.

Repeated violations of the code of conduct may include removal of the ability to name ships or the suspension of a player's RSI account.

Ships purchased in-game cannot be named at this time.
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Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 30 Oct 2022 17:58

Adjudicator I have a question for you.

Right now I have bought three vehicles with real money: the Scorpius, the STV and the Mule. They are worth about $350 in store credit if I melt them.

In a few months, these vehicles will be available to buy at in-game stores with game credits. So, at that time, what’s stopping me from melting all these vehicles and buying on the CIG store the NEXT new vehicles that aren’t yet purchasable in-game? And just keep doing this forever so that with a small amount of a few hundred bucks I can always have ALL the latest vehicles that other people can’t get in the game.

This would motivate me to for example buy right now also the Centurion, and whatever else will be coming in the expo in November. Otherwise, I would only be buying the vehicles I REALLY love, whereas if this trick works, I can be buying EVERYTHING.

Another advantage of this purchase strategy is that it doesn’t pay-to-win older vehicles. The Scorpius for example will be a pretty expensive ship when it hits in-game stores, should be at least 2-3 million, and if I keep it in my hangar I will never have to earn it in the game. I mean I didn’t earn it now, I just paid-to-win it, and if I never melt it I will never truly earn it.

And I know that all these “early access” ships will not be coming with Lifetime Insurance, since they’ll be bought with store credit, but LTI is another big pay-to-win aspect that it’d be best if players didn’t have. Then you will have to figure out effective credit-earning strategies in the game to keep insuring your vehicles with in-game credits.

This approach might motivate more people to put a little more money in the game. For most people, paying $100 for something that will soon be purchasable with in-game credits is a waste of money, but if you tell them instead that this money will always give them the latest vehicles, they might be more inclined to make the investment, and then we could have 3-4 Centurions and Mules and whatever now.

Or take ysignal’s $140 Spirit. I read on Reddit that the ship is in the early concept phase and will take AT LEAST a year to go in the game, and probably even longer. So what is his $140 doing for him all this time? It’s doing nothing. Why not instead melt it and buy a Centurion now, and enjoy it for the 6-10 months it will take to go in the in-game stores, then melt it and buy whatever else is coming soon, and when the Spirit comes in, melt again and buy it?

And finally, you Adjudicator. You have bought THREE Spirits for about $500 plus your Sentinel that costs about $250. You could buy the Carrack with all this, and we can buy you a Sentinel with game credits. With all this money invested, you could always have the latest vehicles, for example anything that’s coming on November 18 in the expo, without ever spending any more money.

Is this strategy possible, or have I made any mistakes in my thinking?
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icycalm
Hyperborean
 
Joined: 28 Mar 2006 00:08
Location: Tenerife, Canary Islands

Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby Adjudicator » 31 Oct 2022 03:41

There are restrictions on what store credit can be used for in order to keep enticing people to "buy and hold" rather than resell or exchange for store credit (melt).


1. Note that pledges that are packaged and/or discounted (Via Warbond or other sales discounts), although they grant items worth more than the real cashmoney you paid for, if the account holder liquidates these special pledges via pledge exchange (melting) will ONLY return the amount of actual real cashmoney (Pledge Melt Value) contributed to the pledge.

My grey market LTI Sentinel (originally an Anvil Legionnaire purchased on 21 May 2022, even before I started the game!) is a prominent example.

The current CIG Pledge Store price of a Vanguard Sentinel is USD 275 (Current Pledge value).

I bought the "LTI Sentinel" from another user for USD 220 (grey market purchase value—the amount I paid in cashmoney that does NOT count to my pledge contribution level as far as CIG is concerned).

Upon opening the ship upgrade log, this is what I discovered:

Final status: Vanguard Sentinel - Pledge melt value: USD 200

To cut a long story short, the original owner of the pledge used the Invictus Launch Week 2952 event which was held from 20 May 2022 to 31 May 2022 to stack multiple Warbond discount Ship Upgrades resulting in a Vanguard Sentinel with a Ship Value of USD 275, but a pledge Melt Value of USD 200. This means I will only ever get USD 200 of store credit if I liquidate this pledge.

TL;DR: Stacking Warbond discounts allow you to sell to other players to make a profit, but one can never cheat the Game God/Spaghetti Monster known as Cloud Imperium Games.

Link to Invictus Launch Week 2952 event: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm ... 52-Details

This "value deficit" and the fact that grey market purchases will never contribute to Concierge level is what made me not bother continuing with the grey market at all.

At that time I committed to the purchase, I was looking for a support role ship, but one that can fight if necessary, as I know the game is in alpha, and that there will always be combat missions no matter the game status.

Reading the Vanguard series specification sheets and official game Q&As convinced me to take the risk to do that purchase, especially the fact that the Vanguard series is described as "modular" and able to swap out parts to have it fulfill other roles.

This "value deficit" would also be present in your RSI Scorpius with unique skin. Open the upgrade history, and you can see that its pledge value is significantly lesser than the current ship value of USD 240 or the original Warbond purchase price of USD 200.


2. As elaborated above, ysignal's and my own Spirit series pledges are significantly discounted, and being Warbond, if we melt these pledges, we only get back store credit the amount we paid for in cashmoney, and if we want these pledges back, we have to buy them back at the undiscounted price.

ysignal pledged for a Crusader Spirit A1, which has a ship value of USD 110, but he only paid USD 100 for it due to the Warbond discount. If he exchanges this pledge, he will only get back USD 100 of store credit.

I pledged for the Spirit series pack, which was only USD 370 in cashmoney. Multi-ship packages are more complicated, as you can only gift or melt the whole package, as the three Spirit variants are coupled together in the package.

This is the list of restrictions on pledge melting and buyback:

Pledge reclaim rules: https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... m-a-Pledge

Store credit restrictions: https://support.robertsspaceindustries. ... ore-Credit


3. Players who pledge for ships in concept or work-in-progress get loaners to approximate the functions of the ships they pledged for. The loaners can be extremely generous and can even be the latest ships as they are deemed to be more appropriate.

Sometimes, as more appropriate ships become flight-ready, the loaners given to players change, and consequently, they get to play with the latest and greatest ship that is capable of approximating the role intended of their pledge.

For example, Banu Merchantman and Large MISC Hull series (Hull C and D) pledge holders get to use many new and ever increasingly larger cargo ships through the game's history.

In the Merchantman's example, the loaners they get are the latest of the large cargo ships. A quick search on Reddit and other Star Citizen forums turned up this list of loaner ships given to Merchantman pledge holders:

2015: MISC Starfarer (Large refueler with 291 SCU cargo)
2018: Drake Caterpillar (576 SCU space container ship)
2021 to present day: Crusader Hercules C2 (696 SCU Cargo ship)

It has also been effective in selling other ships for CIG, as there are topics on how Merchantman pledge holders end up pledging for the Caterpillar and/or a Hercules variant after they tried out the loaner.

For ysignal and myself, we made very heavy use of the Cutlass Black loaner given while awaiting the Crusader C1 Spirit to be ready.

I often use the Cutlass Black to quickly get my refined materials (obtained from Prospector mining) from ARC-L1 refinery to ArcCorp Area 18 to sell them off, alleviating the need to rent or get a dedicated cargo ship for that purpose.

The Freelancer MIS loaner (substituting for the Spirit A2 bomber) lets me try out a Freelancer series ship, which I would normally never purchase due to its aesthetics and logically poor atmospheric/planetary body performance.
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Adjudicator
 
Joined: 12 Mar 2009 13:42
Location: Singapore

Re: Real cashmoney

Unread postby icycalm » 31 Oct 2022 04:51

You gave me a lot of useful info, but still didn't answer my question.

I am not trying to save 10 or 20 bucks here. I don't care if I lose 10 or 20 bucks here or there.

I am trying to figure out if I can invest a FIXED amount of money into the game and use it to ALWAYS have the latest vehicles that CAN'T be purchased in-game. I don't want to spend $1,000/year to buy all the new ships. I want to spend $1,000 ONCE, and use this money to keep buying and melting ships in order to keep buying and melting ships. Is this possible?

It seems to be.

We'll find out for sure when my Scorpius, STV and Mule become available inside the game. At that point I will try to melt them and buy new vehicles that aren't yet available inside the game.
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icycalm
Hyperborean
 
Joined: 28 Mar 2006 00:08
Location: Tenerife, Canary Islands

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